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Cavadus

Star Wars Episode VII Discussion

12 posts in this topic

SPOILERS!!!

 

Okay, overall I really liked the movie and I thought it was better than all of the prequels combined. It felt like a real Star Wars movie and I will definitely be going back to see it a second and third time. That being said, there was actually quite a bit that left me disappointed.

 

1. The Governments

What the fuck is this mess all about? We have the First Order, the bad guys, who are not exactly direct ancestry of the Empire. I have no idea what they control or why they are doing anything. Why did they use the Starkiller to destroy those planets?

 

Then there's the restored Republic which is a thing again. Okay. But now my biggest question.

 

The Resistance. Resistance to what? Is this just a nickname for the Republic military or does the Republic not have a military and the Resistance is basically some paramilitary force who fights on behalf of the Republic or something? And the Republic not having a military makes zero sense. YOU JUST FOUGHT A THIRTY YEAR WAR TO RESTORE THE REPUBLIC. And now no military? Great fucking idea if that's the case.

 

I have zero idea how any of this works. It's like they were wrestling with how to make the Resistance the underdogs when it's clearly the First Order who would be the under dogs.

 

2. Characters

OT characters were all great and exactly what I expected. New ones, though? Only Rey made any damn sense. Poe Dameron was completely superfluous and was in all of four scenes.

 

All of the Imps were a joke. Phasma? What a waste. I thought we were going to get some epic fisticuffs between her and Chewie but she does nothing but walk around.

 

Huxley? They put a whiny tattle-tale twenty-year old in charge of the entire Starkiller operation? I'm shocked they lost.

 

Kylo/Ben? I actually liked him for the first half especially when he would throw a tantrum and follow it up with some dry humor but this guy is not scary, is not fearsome, is not that great with a saber, et cetera. They gave him some impressive force skills here and there but that's it. I really hope he really makes something darkside of himself after killing his dad.

 

3. And my hugest disappointment, Fin. Oy, where to start with this guy. I liked what they did at first prior to his defection. He clearly experiences some battle shock and then refuses to follow some morally evil orders. Got it. I'm onboard. Even when he defects by rescuing Poe I still understand.

 

But later on Huxley tells Ben that all of his stormies were taken at birth and raised to be soldiers. Fin spends all of post-defection movie time being a bumbling moron supplying little else than comic relief.

 

This dude just spent, bare minimum, twenty years being trained to be a soldier. Yet he comports himself exactly like Luke did in episode IV. Even if he's not battle hardened you can't erase all of that training in an instant. I kept waiting for him to flip a switch in tense moments and go into training auto-pilot and just be a badass but the guy literally can't do anything including the shit he spent his entire life learning how to do. This really, really bugged me.

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I felt they took all the successful parts from episodes 4, 5 and 6 and threw them up on a story board, then mashed a plot around it, with a healthy dose of merchandising thrown in for good measure.  The result was pretty good because it's what we liked about the original movies. 

 

Kylo Ren makes a better Anakin than Anakin did.  He has all the character flaws in all the right places and doesn't suddenly swap sides like gramps did and become Sith (based on ep 1,2, 3). 

 

Rey was cool, plus the mystery around her origin has some fun possibilities. 

 

They definitely dropped the ball with Phasma and a few other notables, such as the Jedi that gets wasted in the first 5 minutes, like what was his purpose?  Some speculate he was supposed to protect Rey ala Ben Kenobi, but if that is true then he did a really bad job of it. 

 

My favorite theory about Finn is that he is vaguely force sensitive and it allowed him to overcome his trooper indoctrination, plus that was his first fight, having previously been a sanitation worker. 

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I overall enjoyed the movie and there were but just a few things that bothered me about it.

 

The good:

 

- The action scenes (mostly the ship battles) were tense and packed, which is something i really liked.

 

- The way the old characters got to interact with the new ones made sense (except for the first encounter when Han rescues fin and rey. Maybe it was the force??) and overall were entertaining.

 

- The overall plot of the movie, making it a search for the last jedi alive was also something I enjoyed (mostly after the excess of jedi we have had since episode I came out which is simply ridiculous) and made me want to delve a little deeper into what happened between Luke and Kylo (or most accurately "how" it happened).

 

- The tone of the movie kept me immersed in it. Not too light to be a disney princess movie, not too dark to be unwatchable, not too comic to be considered a comedy, but still had the right tone mixing all those things when it needed to.

 

- The cast was spot on for me. I think the new guys did a great job to not dissapoint when there were incredibly high expectations from the fans about them. I think the torch will be handed to them by the old generation in the last movie of the trilogy, but I feel confident that they will be able to carry it without a problem.

 

- I actually liked the fact that Kylo Ren was struggling to stay on the dark side. There is always talk that the dark side is the one that corrupts people and tempts them, but I guess when darth vader went good it created a precedent for a new generation of sith that have to resist the "temptation" of the light side, even if that temptation is not enough to stop you from stabbing your own father in the chest with a lightsaber.

 

- No jar jar nonsense (or anything similar). Its probably the best thing that they decided not to add any type of stupid comical character. In any case that role might have been intended for BB-08 and he did it in such a way that it was believable, enjoyable and funny enough not to be considered overdone like it was with Jar jar binks.

 

 

Now the bad:

 

- Camera time for captain phasma was way too short. It was a character I was expecting a lot from and I was dissapointed to see that they didnt use her at all to move the plot.

 

- Again the same issue with another character, Poe, from who I was expecting a lot more, even if he has a direct impact on the plot and has some great action scenes, I wished they could have used him a bit more along Fin and Rey during the film.

 

- I also feel like two events were rushed in the main plot, being:

 

* The death of Solo. Unless they were aiming for an excuse for us to actually hate Kylo, I see no other motive why you would kill the character that is probably the most beloved character in the Star Wars saga. Sure, we all love luke, but ask in a room for people to raise their hands if they would rather be luke or Han and im pretty sure the votes are gonna be pouring in for mr. solo.

 

* Rushing Rey's force powers. I know the name of the movie is Force Awakens, and im guessing we can all agree that the title refers to her dicovering her jedi powers, but still, I feel like it shouldve been done in a more subtle way. It doesnt make any sense that someone that has not EVER been trained in the ways of the force, ends up not only resisting a trained force user attemp to mind control her, but actually ends up mind controlling a trooper and being able to pull an object into her hands. Either they dropped the ball on that one, or theyve been lying to us for decades, making us believe that the force is something that needs to be trained for YEARS before anybody can control it like she did. And no, I will not ask for a midichlorian count on her ...... I had enough of that with anakin.

 

 

 

Regarding your concerns Cav, id say that politically, the resistance stands for the rebellion of old. If you remember the rebellion took a lot of losses during that last battle at the death star in episode VI so their military might not be the strongest at the point where episode VII starts. This time they show us that the first order is practically what remains of the old empire (literally) which is not much either. One thing that really baffles me though is the ability that the first order had to conceal the creation of yet another world ending weapon of mass destruction from the resistance. Either the friggin resistance dont have spies (cause the empire killed all the bothans  :D  :D ) or they have a knack for turning a blind eye when their most fearsome enemy is fabricating a weapon of doom.

 

They didnt go much into detail about the political aspects of the new republic, however im hopin that it starts playing a more important factor in the next two movies.

 

I will give fin the benefit of doubt when it comes to battle, mainly because like Campbell said ,he was a mere Janitor before that battle in Jakku to recover the map. I actually liked the character, being scared enough of what he saw to make the decision to abandon something that he was raised to do. Thats the same kind of courage that took Luke Skywalker in the first place to join the rebels in episode IV (well ...... that and the fact that his family went extra crispy in tatooine). I do believe that there will be a much bigger involvement for Fin when it comes to dealings with the force, even if he was unable to use any of it to fight Kylo. The way I see it, the behaviour that was factually correct was Fin's when it came to facing Kylo. He picked up the saber, but he didnt know what to do with it and since he had never been trained in the force he didnt know how to use it or resist it either. The problem with Fin comes when we try to compare it to Rey, which shouldnt be the case, since I believed that rey's super powers were just too damn much for this first movie.

 

Regarding the saber skills that kylo had, im guessing they didnt want to go full on "episode III Kenobi vs Anakin lightsaber badass/asskicking" and decided to tone it down to a more "They are still trying to grasp the concepts of saber fighting again by themselves", however after we saw Rey kicking ass with her staff during the movie, I could totally envision her with a double bladed lightsaber ala Satele Shan kicking even more ass than darth maul in episode I.

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I have to express my concerns about the super deathstar.  First, how the hell do they move it around the galaxy?  It's a fucking planet, you don't just strap thrusters to it and move it.  Second, where did it get a sun to suck down for the second time they fired it?  If it consumes one sun per firing, and it fired the first time to destroy the galactic republic planets, where did it get a second sun to suck up so it could fire a second time?

 

On a lighter note, there is a fan theory that the super deathstar planet was from the same solar system as Ilum, given that it likely uses a very large one of those fancy crystals as its focusing lens, ala a giant lightsaber.  Ilum was traditionally where Jedi went to get their lightsaber crystals, and the Imps wanted them for their own weapons, hence the battle going on over Ilum in TOR. 

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There was nothing about it using the entire sun for each shot. All they said was it would be able to stay there and fire at targets until the sun was consumed, then they could move it to a new location.

 

As for moving it, that would be one hell of a feat for sure!

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* The death of Solo. Unless they were aiming for an excuse for us to actually hate Kylo, I see no other motive why you would kill the character that is probably the most beloved character in the Star Wars saga. Sure, we all love luke, but ask in a room for people to raise their hands if they would rather be luke or Han and im pretty sure the votes are gonna be pouring in for mr. solo.

 

Don't forget Harrison Ford had that really bad plane accident right in the middle of the shooting that severely injured him and he had mentioned somewhere he originally didn't want to come back for VII but was coaxed into doing it.

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Yeah, Ford seemed to really resent the role over the years.  In all of the recent articles he said it was the payday that brought him back.  Was it really so bad being the most beloved and popular character in all of Star Wars?

Yup. Rumor has it these are the cast salaries. Roughly. So clearly someone had to keep making Ford's check bigger till he caved and came back.

 

Harrison Ford received an eight-figured paycheck ($10-20 million).
Carrie Fisher and Mark Hamill made salaries in the low seven-figure range.
Oscar Isaac and Adam Driver got mid- to high-six figures (above $500,000).
Daisy Ridley and John Boyega earned something between $100,000-$300,000.

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